02 Apr REMEMBERING FORMER SENATOR JOE LIEBERMAN A”H LOOKING BACK: AN EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW WITH THE FORMER SENATOR IN 2018

Joe Lieberman, the Shomer Shabbos former four-term US Senator from Connecticut and Democratic nominee for Vice President in 2000, was niftar this past Wednesday in New York City at the age of 82 due to complications from a fall. Senator Lieberman was a member of the Jewish community who made history and was mekadesh shem shamayim, bringing honor to Hashem and the Torah, while doing so. After a distinguished career as Attorney General of Connecticut and U.S. Senator, Joe Lieberman was the first Jewish American nominated to a national ticket as the Democratic Party’s nominee for Vice President in 2000.
Lieberman was a self-described centrist Democrat who championed causes like environmental protection, and gun control. However, his willingness to deviate from party lines, particularly in his hawkish foreign policy stances, often sparked controversy.

Notably, in 2009, the Senator walked nearly five miles from his home and shul in Georgetown to make it to the Senate in time for votes on healthcare amendments that Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid had scheduled for Shabbos afternoon.
Senator Lieberman is the author of seven books on history, government, law, and religion, including “The Gift of Rest: Rediscovering the Beauty of the Sabbath” & “The Journey from Freedom to Matan Torah”. He was married to Hadassah Freilich Lieberman. They have four children and many grandchildren.
In 2018, right after the Senator came out with his book “The Journey from Freedom to Matan Torah” I had the honor to interview Senator Lieberman. He was a true mentsch and a decent person, something that has sadly become increasingly rare in politics. Below is the interview.

Where did you get your Jewish education? Did you go to any Yeshivas growing up?
I was born in Stamford Connecticut and educated by my rabbi, Rabbi Joseph Ehrenkranz. Great teacher- he built the largest Orthodox shul in town. I went to the Talmud Torah two days
a week: After public school and on Sunday. It was not a great experience, truthfully. There was no day school back then in Stamford. So when I got to high school age, Rabbi Ehrenkranz
tried to convince my parents and me to send me to MTA: he thought that I might want to be a rabbi. My parents were not ready to send me there and I was not ready to go there. When I
was in college, I stopped observing some mitzvot, but no matter what else I was doing, I would put on tefillin and daven shacharis. Afterwards, I returned to Orthodox Judaism, and I began to read, study and take classes.

Who’s your religious mentor? Who do you ask religious questions to?
At different times in my career, I would ask different Rabbis. I’ve asked Rabbi Ehrenkranz, I’ve asked Rabbi Albert Feldman of the Westville Synagogue in New Haven, but he’s retired now.
Today I would ask Rabbi Menachem Genack of the OU, who has become  friend and a teacher to me. It happens to be that his son Yitzy is now the Rabbi of the Riverdale Jewish Center
shul where I daven.

Was there ever a specific time in your political career that you remember something happening on Shabbos that you couldn’t participate in and you said, “Oh, I wish I could have, but you know, just because of Shabbos, I can’t participate in it?”
There were times, certainly in the beginning of my career before I got accustomed to it, that it would have been in my best interest. With the advice of my Rabbis, I have learned that there’s a difference between participating in political events and fulfilling a governmental responsibility. And this is based on various opinions given by Rabbis in Israel about military intelligence
and what people in government can and cannot do. Here’s an example. We would often have to vote on Shabbos when I was a state senator and sometimes they would push it off to Saturday night or the following Monday. But several times during my time in the Senate, probably 40 to 50 times over 24 years, I would walk from my home to the Senate to vote. Fortunately, it is a very antiquated system in the house and they call your name and you just say yes or no. So that was the most observant kind of voting possible. Another example: In 1978, there was a state senator majority leader in Connecticut. The Lieutenant Governor Democratic challenge was challenging the governor for the nomination for governor. So there was an opening for lieutenant governor. I was one of probably eight or nine candidates, but the convention was always on Shabbos in Connecticut, so I couldn’t go. I had a lot of support and I came in second but there are still a lot of people who say that I probably could have gotten that nomination had I been there. Unfortunately, it just so happens that the governor, and nobody knew it at the time, got renominated, got re-elected with her new lieutenant, But life was pretty good for me. I ran for Congress two years later and I lost. But then I ran for attorney general. I won and I got re-elected. It was a wonderful six years. I loved being attorney general. And then I had this extraordinary honor and privilege of being elected to the Senate in 1988, which I did for 24 years. And then I even got a chance to run for vice president! I dreamed of being a senator. I never dreamed of being vice president or president. But thank G-d for the opportunity. So what I’m saying is yes, I could look back at a day like that in 1978 and say that had I been there, I would’ve been nominated. But I have no angst about it- It was Shabbos and I made a promise to
myself. I’m at peace with it.

Did you ever experience eantisemitism while you were in political office either from other politicians or people from around the country, especially when you were running for Vice President?
I never confronted any antisemitism in Connecticut, and by that I mean outright antisemitism. That was phenomenal. I was elected state senator five times. I was elected attorney general twice, and I was elected to the US Senate four times. Obviously. I’m not saying there is no antisemitism in Connecticut, but I’m confident it’s a very small group. I think that we’ve reached the stage in our history as a country where antisemitism is not acceptable. Certainly, it wasn’t in my time. As a senator, every now and then I would get hate mail, where people would get angry about something. And sometimes there would be something anti-Semitic in it. I would turn it over to the Capitol police, which was what we were advised to do. And then when I ran for Vice President, people told me that there was a little bit of a flareup of anti-Semitism in the first couple of days on the Internet. But again, I will tell you that I saw no antisemitism. In
fact, I would say it was the opposite! I had one secret service agent who was with me during the 2000 campaign who had done I think three other national campaigns before. He said, “I’ve never been on a campaign where so many people say to the candidate, ‘G-d bless you.’” His theory was that they respected the fact that not only was I Jewish, but that I was a religious Jew. It was quite remarkable. I’ll tell you one funny story. I’m pretty sure it was right after I got nominated. I was in Iowa and there was a big crowd. I looked out and I thought I saw five or
six signs in Yiddish. So I said to the governor of Iowa, “Are those signs in Yiddish?” And he told me that there was a kosher meat plant nearby so they probably came over from there!

What was Shabbos observance like when you were in the Senate?
I actually told this story in my book “The Gift of Rest: Rediscovering the Beauty of Shabbat.’’ It’s a Friday night, raining one of those torrential downpours that we get in Washington, D.C., and I am walking from the Capitol to my home in Georgetown, getting absolutely soaked. A United States Capitol policeman is at my side, as we make our way up Pennsylvania Avenue from the Capitol building toward our distant goal, a four-and- a-half-mile walk. Before leaving my Senate office I changed into sneakers, but now they are full of water. As we slosh forward, a Capitol police car travels alongside for extra security at a stately pace. But I do not – indeed I cannot – accept a ride in the car. What accounts for this strange scene? The presence of the two
policemen is easily explained. As the Senate’s sergeant at arms, who oversees the Capitol police, once said to me, ‘Senator, if something happens to you on my watch while you’re walking home, it will be bad for my career.’ So that’s why the police are with me. But why am I walking instead of riding on a rainy night? Because it’s Friday night, the Sabbath, the day of rest when observant Jews like me do not ride in cars.

When you were in political office, did you ever have to vote for something that was neged halacha (against Jewish law)?
I didn’t think so, but I’m sure there are people who thought so. There are times I voted for legislation to protect people who were discriminated against based on their sexual orientation, so maybe they would say that was contrary to halacha. I always felt that halacha affected my own behavior in that regard, but that it was also consistent with Jewish values that we should protect people from being discriminated against because we are all created b’tzelem Elokim. I can’t think of a case where I felt torn by halacha, where I had to vote against what I was thinking.

How would you grade President Trump so far as the President of the United States?
My feelings are mixed, so I don’t know what I would give him if I had to give him a grade. I personally voted for Hillary, to be direct about it. One of the challenges with President Trump,
which I try to discipline myself to do, is to take him based on the positions he takes on issues, both domestic and foreign, not to form my opinion too much based on his tweets, what he says
about other people, and his personal behavior. But that’s difficult because leaders are held to a higher standard. Like the Kohanim are held to a higher standard by virtue of the fact that
they are leaders. Generally speaking, I have been pleased with his foreign policy. Generally speaking, I think he’s reasserted American strength. I was worried, and a lot of people were
worried during the campaign, that he would pull us into a new kind of isolationism that I don’t think works for us. We have to be careful about being too involved with the rest of
the world, but there’s a middle point that’s appropriate. He hasn’t been an isolationist at all, he’s been actively involved with foreign policy. I think he’s handled the Middle East very
well. I think he’s now in a moment of unusual opportunity with Korea. I believe in trade, but I believe in fair trade. I’m not offended when he rails about the extent to which the Chinese
for instance, are not treating us fairly, but I think he’s got to be careful not to actually let this get into a real trade war. It needs to end with a negotiation that gives us more favorable trade terms with, for instance, China and even our allies in Europe. So, I’m kind of mixed. I’m an environmentalist so I don’t like that he pulled us out of the climate change treaty. Generally speaking, I thought that the tax bill was a good idea, but it does add to our debt which is now going to go over twenty trillion dollars and our kids are going to have to pay for it. In the short and medium turn, it has had a positive effect on the economy, which is quite good. So it’s mixed.

Why do you think it took so long for a U.S. president to move the US embassy to Yerushalayim?
I was very active in the adoption of the law in 1995, which mandated that the US recognize Jerusalem as the true capital of Israel and that the embassy be moved to Yerushalayim. I was working closely with the Majority Leader at that time, Bob Dole, and with Pat Moynihan of New York. 1995 was two years after the Oslo Accords and there was much hope for peace in the Middle East. The Clinton administration took the position that adopting that bill at that point was premature and it would diminish the hopes for peace. Of course we argued that it just was not true. Israel was the only country in the world where America didn’t have an embassy in the city that the country designates as its capital. It was going to go to a piece of land in West Jerusalem that was owned by Israel since 1948, so there was no way that even in a two-state solution that land would go to Palestine. President Clinton said he would veto it and the negotiations started, which gave him the right every six months and his successors to waive it to suspend the effectiveness of the act. And for 22 years, almost 23, Presidents Clinton,
Bush and Obama suspended the act. And the basic premise was that it would affect the peace process, that the Arab world would react, that the Arab street would rise up, etc. That was until December of last year when President Trump, to his credit, said this is the law and it’s the right thing to do. He also had a confidence that there would not be that extreme a reaction as people were calculating. Truthfully, the Arab world has reacted with concern, but they’re much more focused on the threat of Iran, which is Israel’s concern, as well. I give President Trump a lot of credit that he made this decision, which really should have been made a long time ago. Essentially we were allowing the fears of other people’s predictions to stop us, the world’s superpower and strongest nation, from doing what we thought was right and what our law required us to do. That was a weak position to be in, so I’m grateful that President Trump turned it around.

Did you ever ask President Bill Clinton or any other US President to pardon Jonathan Pollard?
No, I didn’t. I had a rule, and this was very controversial. People in the community were upset about it. I had a rule from the beginning, not related to Pollard but to criminal cases where
they asked me if I would intervene in a case, file a letter with a judge, or even ask for a pardon, but I really did not feel that was my role. I’m a legislator. They weren’t asking me because they needed another lawyer. They had very good lawyers. They were asking me because they were hoping I would influence the judge and that was not appropriate. So, I didn’t do that. After I got out of office, I did sign a few letters with the Attorney General asking Pollard to be released because it no longer was bound by the Senate. I had concluded that Pollard had violated the law seriously, but by the time I was out of the Senate in 2012/2013, it seemed to me that he had served a long enough term, to put it mildly, and on humanitarian grounds he should be released. So, I’m glad he was.

What’s your biggest regret in politics? Any regrets?
I don’t have regrets, that’s not in my nature, but there are things I worked on that I wish I had completed. I really believe that climate change is a problem. I worked for eight to ten
years with various co-sponsors, usually Republicans, because I figured if I didn’t have a Republican co sponsor I wouldn’t have a chance. And the second, which I worked on in the last five years, which I still continue to be concerned about, was to do something to improve our defenses against Cyber attacks. And we’re doing better, but not well enough. About 85 percent of our critical infrastructure, such as electric utility grids, the financial computer systems, etc. is owned privately, and so it’s not the government in charge. We have to figure out a way to give them incentives and the kind of pushes they need to do more to protect cyber space because it’s very vulnerable to enemy attack.

Please tell everyone about your new book “The Journey from Freedom to Matan Torah” and about your relationship with your co-author Rabbi Ari Kahn.
The book is really about the importance of law, Jewish life, and history, The larger point is that what happened at Har Sinai was a critical step in the history of civilization and played a significant role in the adoption of systems of law, particularly in western civilization, but also in other civilizations. The Torah’s story of the journey of Bnai Yisrael from slavery in Mitzrayim to receiving the law on Har Sinai is a really important message from Hashem, which is that freedom is your birthright, our birthright. That’s why Hashem re-entered history to liberate us from slavery in Egypt. But if there’s no law, ultimately people descend to chaos, violence, and immorality and perhaps even self-destruction. So we need the law to make us better than we’d otherwise be. The other sub-theme here is about the holiday of Shavuot, which is greatly under-appreciated, certainly in the Jewish world. It follows and is directly connected to Pesach, which is of course the most widely celebrated Jewish holiday. Jews who observe Pesach don’t observe Shavuot, don’t even know about it, and don’t count the omer. They are missing the second half of the performance, which, to use a metaphor I use in the book, is like missing the second half of the performance. You’re leaving the theater before it’s over! Yes, of course the exodus is critically important. It’s very important, but it was for a purpose, not just to be let loose from slavery, but to go to Har Sinai, to get our national mission statement, the Torah, and then to go to Eretz Yisrael. For non-Jewish readers, I hope it reminds them of or informs them of what I believe is the critical role of the revelation on Har Sinai, which is how Hashem’s giving of the law has impacted the development of law and civilization, particularly in the western world, but more broadly, as well. In regards to my collaboration with Rabbi Ari Kahn, my teacher, my friend and publisher, Rabbi Menachem Genack of the OU suggested that since I wanted to collaborate with someone, Rabbi Ari Kahn would be the person. I didn’t know him, but once I met him I liked him very much. I read his books and we had a very collaborative, productive relationship. I’m grateful to him. To me, Rabbi Kahn is a rising star in the world of Jewish scholarship.

FAST FACTS:

Name: Joseph Isadore Lieberman
Hebrew name: Yosef Yisrael ben Chanan
Born: February 24,1942 in Stamford, Connecticut
Died: March 27, 2024 (age 82 years)
Spouse: Hadassah Lieberman (m. 1982),
Elizabeth Haas (m. 1965–1981)
Graduated: Yale University and Yale Law School

United States Senator from Connecticut- January 3, 1989 – January 3, 2013 (24 years)
Political parties: Democratic (before 2006), Independent (2006–present)
After 2018: Was a senior counsel at the law firm of Kasowitz, Benson, Torres LLP in New York and Chairman of United Against Nuclear Iran (UANI).
Davened in Riverdale at: The Riverdale Jewish Center

FUN QUESTIONS:

What’s your favorite Yom Tov?
Really, it’s Shabbos, but honestly second place is Shavuos.
Favorite person in Tanach.
I’m probably biased by name, but Yosef. I loved the stories about Yosef. I read them every year, as if I had never read them before- those parshiot.
Favorite parsha in the Torah.
Wow, that’s interesting. Maybe it’s the parshiot of the ten commandments, but I’ll tell you for emotional pull, it’s the parshah where Yosef reveals himself to his brothers. To me, that’s so compelling.
I believe that your father ran a liquor store. What’s your favorite liquor to use for kiddush?
Well, at the Riverdale Jewish Center, we’ve now graduated to single malt scotch. But at home, because thank G-d the kinderlach are usually around and I want them to participate, it’s Kedem grape juice, but I’m a wine drinker most of the time.

If you could schmooze with somebody on a bench for an hour, one person, anybody from the beginning of time, who would it be?
I’m torn between my religion and my politics. But I’d say, probably, I’d like to talk to Moshe Rabbeinu. If I had a political choice, I’m always intrigued by Abraham Lincoln and Teddy Roosevelt. Either one of those would be a lot of fun to talk to.
Favorite song to sing at the Shabbos table.
Yona Matza.
One middah that you think all of Klal Yisrael should work on.
I don’t want to be judgemental, but probably Lashon Hara. It’s the thing that rabbis most talk about because it’s probably the one that is most violated by most people. It’s human nature.